Replies

• Alfredo Pereira Jr

  27 November 2007 | 00:55

  Dear Jim:

  The most accepted option is signaling by means of a pattern of (spatial and/or temporal) variation in calcium ion concentration.
  Quantum entanglement is not probable in this context (although I think it is possible for ions trapped in astrocytic gap junctions and/or in dendritic spines).
  Your last alternative is the one that I prefer. I have argued that in order to specify one state of calmodulin calcium ions should have at least 3 different stable conformations (since calmodulin has sites to bind 4 ou 5 ions, and there are hundreds of different conformations of this protein; if ions have 3 conformations then 3×3x3×3x3 different states of calmodulin could be determined). This argument was developed in my paper published here

  Best Regards,

  Alfredo Pereira Jr.

• Jim Fraser

  27 November 2007 | 14:30

  Dr. Pereira

  Thanks for your detailed reply.

  I’ve read “Glutamatergic Mechanisms of Perceptual Learning” [REIC – v.5, n.1 (2006)] and am still puzzled. The Hughes et al paper cited there describes the creation of multiple states of a different Ca ion (Ca+) in highly controlled conditions for very short lifetimes. I find it hard to imagine analogous long-lived states of Ca++ in physiological conditions. Is there anything in the literature to support that?

  On the other hand, it doesn’t seem to me that your argument really depends on the existence of every one of calmodulin’s hundreds of possible states. A rich variety of calmodulin configurations should be possible with just conventional Ca++ binding variations plus other possible interactions in this highly complex and poorly understood environment.

  Regards,

  Jim Fraser

• Ronald Blue

  27 November 2007 | 18:36

  Consider that it could be an effect related to oscillons or Faraday waves separating the ions due to mechanical vibrations of the membrane. Such an effect would separate the different types of ions and could be related to information signals and have quantum mechanical connections.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscillon
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_wave

• Ronald Blue

  27 November 2007 | 21:22

  Also a rf Paul trap would work for computation and quantum based consciousness. The slow modulations would be perfect for consciousness entrainment.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trapped_ion_quantum_computer

• Alfredo Pereira Jr

  28 November 2007 | 01:00

  Dear Jim and Ron:

  I am also puzzled, but tending to agree with Ron. Quantum computing has been studied in restricted conditions (ultra-cooled, isolated systems) but the principles it reveals may be universal. If no complementary mechanism is found for the encoding of information in calcium populations, perhaps my hypothesis of different electronic configurations of the ions and Ron’s ideas about Faraday waves and RF Paul traps could receive more attention in brain sciences.
  Many thanks Ron for your insight! Your sugestions will be useful in the case I am able to further develop the sketchy model presented in a paper published in the journal Quantum Biosystems (see the group’s publications). Right now I imagine that the ions could get entangled in the astrocytic syncytium and then quantum computations take place (the way that you suggest) while some of them cross neuronal membrane channels.
  And many thanks Jim for reading and criticizing my papers!

  Best Regards,

  Alfredo

• Ronald Blue

  28 November 2007 | 16:59

  Actually high temperature quantum computers exist.
  Consider the ability of carbon tetrachloride to store information and glycerin.

  Put a drop of blue ink in a spinning container of carbon tetrachloride and watch is diffuse out. Now reverse the spin and see the diffused ink come back into a concentrated drop of blue ink. That is quantum entrainment memory.